Cool URIs Don't Change (1998)

www.w3.org
Klaster_1
10 hours ago
177points
38 comments

Comments

torh6 hours ago
Not that long ago I clicked on a link that Microsoft provided somewhere in Windows -- could have been the event log, I don't remember. I do remember it was for a specific support article, but it ended up at a generic landing page for something. I am not talking about a link from Windows 95, it must have been Windows 10. But regardless, it is all gone. Then again, it probably wasn't a cool URL to begin with.

It's amazingly many news sites that also seem to scrub their URLs every time they do a redesign. Also uncool.

phillipseamore3 hours ago
Got an MX4 yesterday and it has a printed card with "Go to logitech.com/mx to get started" resulting in a "Forbidden" error page. This product hasn't even been out for a year!
mikepurvis15 minutes ago
Might have been an overeager packaging designer that printed that and then filed a ticket for someone to set up the redirect and that ticket is still in the person's queue.

Or it's something about your own connection. Maybe an ad blocker? For me, the redirect works:

    $ curl -IL logitech.com/mx 2>/dev/null | grep http
    Location: https://logitech.com:443/mx
    location: https://www.logitech.com:443/mx
    location: https://www.logitech.com/en-ca/mx.html
(I have the Mechanical Mini keyboard and the 3S Anywhere mouse; I like the MX product line.)
selcuka14 minutes ago
That URL works for me. It must be an issue on your end.
thephyber32 minutes ago
There is no financial incentive for most companies to maintain extremely old URLs. There is no large visible cost known to the project manager at a company who chooses to migrate to a different CMS.

A common solution is to create placeholders at the old URLs with permanent redirects to the new URLs, but that doesn't fix all of the old hyperlinks, so it becomes extremely expensive to maintain backwards compatibility after 2 or more CMS changes.

phatskat3 hours ago
I bought an air conditioner last year, some wal-mart “smart” AC that was affordable (we had to get three for the new house we moved in to so budget was a big concern) and it has a QR code for the companion app. I finally got around to getting the app this summer and lo and behold, it’s a dead link. Yay.
sixtyj5 hours ago
Average time of url is 5 years.

Therefore I try to make a local copy of a document that I link to.

There a plugin for Firefox that can check bookmarked links. You will be surprised how they vanish pretty fast…

beached_whale5 hours ago
Microsoft has a terrible habit of doing that. KB's used to have a predicable URL, they may again, but they keep changing them. Or any of their docs really. It's terrible as those URL's end up in other documents to be killed. This is not really an enterprise friendly way of supporting customers.
toyg4 hours ago
Yeah, I always wondered how one of the wealthiest companies on earth could be so poor in linking to their own documentation.

Then I realized that they have a galaxy of consultants and experts that effectively make a living by keeping on top of all issues and fixing them for a fee. So there is little incentive for them to actually be user-friendly: as long as they are "partner friendly" with timely material, that's good enough.

They are not alone in this, btw - pretty much all major platform providers do this, one way or the other.

sippeangelo1 hour ago
I've given up because half the help links in the control panel leads to a bing search without any helpful results at all
Panino3 hours ago
Mailing list archive software is a constant rug pull: today you link to a post about something relevant, and next month the link goes to a different message about a different subject.
sghiassy5 hours ago
Entropy
donatj9 minutes ago
I find that every time major companies as well as most authors switch blogging systems even if they maintain their URLs broadly, their RSS feed url breaks.
mikepurvis7 hours ago
Sadly, though:

    $ curl -I https://www.nsf.gov/pubs/1998/nsf9814/nsf9814.htm
    HTTP/2 404 
    content-type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
    content-length: 54737
    date: Sun, 09 Aug 2026 17:58:44 GMT
    strict-transport-security: max-age=31536000; includeSubdomains; preload
    server: Apache
MarkSweep1 hour ago
It was removed in 2025 sometime between May 7th and September 11th:

https://web.archive.org/web/20250000000000*/https://www.nsf....

Maybe its removal is related to this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2025_United_States_government_...

firasd7 hours ago
What this page doesn't mention is 301 or 302 redirects. SEO has made "old URLs staying live" more of a widespread concern than it was at the time. And WordPress etc ship with inbuilt redirects upon slug rename

So to a large extent this has been mitigated and not using the suggestion here, which is to create a permanent URL ontology upfront

That said eventually neglect, removal, reorgs (or simply websites going offline) still happens... but the way the suggested goal has been advanced is due to becoming a business priority and with redirects and CMSes as tech to help

That said one suggestion made here turned out to be very useful and indeed is the default in WP:

   http://www.w3.org/1998/12/01/chairs
If you use date as part of the taxonomy then -- as Tim BL says here:

> A reason for using a topic area as part of the URI is that responsibility for sub-parts of a URI space is typically delegated, and then you need a name for the organizational body - the subdivision or group or whatever - which has responsibility for that sub-space. This is binding your URIs to the organizational structure. It is typically safe only when protected by a date further up the URI (to the left of it): 1998/pics can be taken to mean for your server "what we meant in 1998 by pics", rather than "what in 1998 we did with what we now refer to as pics."

bensyverson7 hours ago
Yes but how often in practice does the same information stay accessible via 30x redirects after one reorganization, let alone two or three?
krupkinmaxim4 hours ago
[flagged]
EGreg6 hours ago
Sounds like most URIs have been downright uncool, then!
_carbyau_24 minutes ago
A side effect of the idea that this information can be "permanent" means you should really think before putting it up there.

But today is not that, it is the opposite of that with stuff being put online that really doesn't need to be. This is permaweb vs slopweb.

zibw7 hours ago
A classic. This keeps getting more credible as it ages. Now it's been at the same URI for 28 years.
mooreds10 hours ago
Great article, lots and lots of past discussion: https://hn.algolia.com/?q=cool+uris
WalterGR7 hours ago
This post is related to (inspired by?):

"The original URL for this prediction will no longer be available in 11 years (2011)" (longbets.org)

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49228458

186 points | 12 hours ago | 91 comments

doubletwoyou1 hour ago
The funny thing is that the reason for me posting the long bet was looking through previous posts about Cool URLs. It comes full circle!
sunaookami3 hours ago
Always like it when Hacker News "follows" a topic over days with different related links. Kinda like a bonus for reading HN daily :)
namanyayg5 hours ago
OP is from 1998 so it's the other way around
WalterGR5 hours ago
I meant the post/submission itself, not the content.
glacials5 hours ago
If you run a statically generated website, I recommend append-only generation, where you keep your `dist/` (or whatever web root) stateful between builds. This guarantees you don't break URIs even if the static generator changes or the source content is removed.

You can even make an orphan branch and check out that branch into `dist/` as a worktree to keep it under version control.

cxr4 hours ago
Even for people who don't practice this, if you're publishing a static site, you can make sure you're generating output with rel=canonical links and at any given point, you should be able to run a tool (entirely separate from your chosen static site generator) over the output to extract those URLs and verify at time t2 that the set of links that existed at t1 (where t1 < t2) is a subset of those at t2.
Swizec3 hours ago
I've been trying to keep all URLs backwards compatible forever on swizec.com and it's surprisingly hard. I _think_ anything from 2010 onward should be good. The domain started in 2005.

Unfortunately I'll never know for sure.